tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post1314306238238274768..comments2024-03-28T02:00:11.260-05:00Comments on A Newbie's Guide to Publishing: New Punctuation?JA Konrathhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-74143155372707386542019-07-02T13:22:27.221-05:002019-07-02T13:22:27.221-05:00Yup, excellent example that flew *right* over my h...Yup, excellent example that flew *right* over my head. I well deserve anything you can throw at me :)<br />Rashkaehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05660928535084641163noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-27909492108421316252019-07-02T12:56:13.085-05:002019-07-02T12:56:13.085-05:00That is not an Oxford comma. There is no Oxford co...<i>That is not an Oxford comma. There is no Oxford comma in your example. The comma between Racism and Children would always be required.</i><br /><br />Uh, Rashkae, that's the point I'm making. There was no Oxford comma in my example, which gave the sentence a different (and horrible) meaning.<br /><br />So I shall now mock you.<br /><br />Mock. Mock mock.<br /><br />:)JA Konrathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-33114778201363733802019-07-02T08:22:14.470-05:002019-07-02T08:22:14.470-05:00Since the other grammar nazis haven't shown up...Since the other grammar nazis haven't shown up yet, I'll get this show on the road.<br /><br />That is not an Oxford comma. There is no Oxford comma in your example. The comma between Racism and Children would always be required.<br /><br />The Oxford comma, had there been one, would have been before the and:<br /><br />For example, consider my favorite blogs: Stomp Out Racism, Children Are Precious, and A Newbie's Guide To Publishing<br /><br />It's controversial, but I think using it can make sentences more clear. What if one of your favorite blogs included the word "and" in it's full name?<br /><br />As usual when I post something like this, I expect I made about 20 mistakes. Feel free to mock them.Rashkaehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05660928535084641163noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-29932367603589344122019-07-01T12:40:44.522-05:002019-07-01T12:40:44.522-05:00I've struggled with italics or 's/he thoug...I've struggled with italics or 's/he thought' for a long time. I've used both and also relied on tense shifts to signal it, i.e. in a past tense narrative my character's inner voice is present tense because, well, they're thinking it right then.<br />Diples could work well, although as a person who was in the computer industry I've had it ingrained to not use characters with special meaning to computers. For example in Unix, the # means something to the processor so it shouldn't be used outside its proper usage. <br />Diples signal HTML code in my head so I would worry that their use would have a negative effect in ebooks or web previews of the text.<br />I assume you've had no issues with this? It sounds like a great way to highlight internal monologue without making it too in-your-face. Edmund de Wighthttp://edmunddewight.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-80035881614860853652019-06-30T12:59:05.262-05:002019-06-30T12:59:05.262-05:00I'm not that experienced with reading diple te...I'm not that experienced with reading diple text, but with thought attribution in TPPT we read, <i>The thought can be the thing</i> thought Hammet. Whereas, in using the diple, the third person past tense thought becomes a third person present tense thought. A clever shift to enhance immediacy in the transaction. Nicely done, JAK.John Ellsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10673913444403940178noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-11288366657349157162019-06-29T22:46:22.810-05:002019-06-29T22:46:22.810-05:00Thanks for chiming in, Jack. I keep one POV per se...Thanks for chiming in, Jack. I keep one POV per sections, so the diples always belong to the POV character. JA Konrathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-17482693390540094922019-06-29T08:27:03.567-05:002019-06-29T08:27:03.567-05:00I've been using the diple since the beginning,...I've been using the diple since the beginning, 2013 for me (Combat Wizard). My characters were psi's and after a while, quotation marks and italics simply didn't do the job. Later on, I used them for radio communications. The primary character used quotation marks while speaking, the person responding via radio got diples and when more than one was involved, I used italics. <br />Necessary if you publish in audio format; it tells the narrator who's speaking.<br />I've also found it necessary to include the name of the character, usually early in the conversation: "I understand," Mac said. "What should I do next?"<br />In part, I do that because I caught flak from readers who couldn't tell from the context which character was saying what. <br />If you publish in audio format, you'll likely need to do the same.Jack Knapphttp://jlknapp505.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-66391134923011549182019-06-28T09:01:44.979-05:002019-06-28T09:01:44.979-05:00Domino, I think the easiest fix for speaker attrib...Domino, I think the easiest fix for speaker attribution would be to give different characters different color dialog, so they were instantly recognized. But that might be intrusive.<br /><br />Yeah, the diple could definitely cause problems via html. But so far so good...JA Konrathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-85159148276366932832019-06-28T06:10:12.070-05:002019-06-28T06:10:12.070-05:00You were concerned about formatting issues with th...You were concerned about formatting issues with the tilde so decided to go with an html opening bracket?!?! :) I jest...<br /><br />All the various brackets are great for this sort of thing because we're all familiar with parentheses as clear asides. I've even seen authors use different bracket types to identify the speaker, but that gets a lot more dicey and specific.Domino Finnnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-91368145382848166722019-06-27T20:59:06.980-05:002019-06-27T20:59:06.980-05:00Love the Oxford comma. Dislike excessive exclamati...Love the Oxford comma. Dislike excessive exclamation marks.<br /><br />Some writers try to avoid dialogue tags by having their characters constantly move about to the point where I get dizzy (He stood up...he sat down...he ran a hand through his hair...he slammed his palm against the table, etc.). To me it's best to have a healthy balance of both, and of course in many cases neither is needed.<br /><br />The expression that really gets to me is, "he/she thought to himself/herself." I mean, think about it.bettye griffinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04457387770524295498noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-30462766053307267382019-06-27T13:23:42.707-05:002019-06-27T13:23:42.707-05:00Thanks Joe, got it.Thanks Joe, got it.Paolo Amorosohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03789843965489611451noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-21915201590875726472019-06-27T11:40:03.996-05:002019-06-27T11:40:03.996-05:00No, only English so far. I wish I could expand int...No, only English so far. I wish I could expand into other languages (especially Russian, given the setting), but I don't have the resources on my own. One day, hopefully.Ted Crosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09022309459554237650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-82627329349209786042019-06-27T11:38:20.037-05:002019-06-27T11:38:20.037-05:00I can't read Cormac McCarthy because of his is...I can't read Cormac McCarthy because of his issues with punctuation. I tried in high school, gave the book back to the library immediately without getting through a chapter. Tried again as an adult, and may have been even more repulsed than the teen version of me was. Oh well, lots of folks like it and I can always hope they make decent movies.Ken Lindseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12113460297980380216noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-34437808492687311872019-06-27T11:35:46.470-05:002019-06-27T11:35:46.470-05:00They looked the same but are slightly stretched
G...<i>They looked the same but are slightly stretched</i><br /><br />Guillemets. They're used instead of quotes in France to set off dialog.<br /><br />Was your book translated into French? If so, I'm really curious what they used to differentiate the two.JA Konrathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-90065222939235035362019-06-27T11:28:03.913-05:002019-06-27T11:28:03.913-05:00Paolo, when using quotation marks the rule is to l...Paolo, when using quotation marks the rule is to leave them open until the dialog ends. If there is a paragraph in the middle of dialog, you remind the reader that it is still dialog by repeating the quotes, and only use ending quotes when the full dialog has ended.<br /><br />Same principle with the diples.JA Konrathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-37437982561117888642019-06-27T10:29:35.570-05:002019-06-27T10:29:35.570-05:00Sorry, I should have also mentioned that my book f...Sorry, I should have also mentioned that my book formatter changed the < > to a slightly different character set so that it wouldn't mess with any HTML tags while he was formatting the book. They looked the same but are slightly stretched--sorry I don't know what they are called.Ted Crosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09022309459554237650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-35857132412440502782019-06-27T10:26:29.475-05:002019-06-27T10:26:29.475-05:00The Immortality Game is my first novel using those...<i>The Immortality Game</i> is my first novel using those tags to offset dialogue. I'm currently writing a sequel that also will use them heavily.Ted Crosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09022309459554237650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-19588253432298499852019-06-27T09:47:18.620-05:002019-06-27T09:47:18.620-05:00Great tips. I've used Stephen King's "...Great tips. I've used Stephen King's "On Writing" as my bible for the last, nearly 20 years. The Elements of Style work great too but I enjoyed your comparison between new punctuation in novels compared to the progress of films. Have you ever read any Mark Z. Danielewski's work or Steven Hall's novel, "The Raw Shark Texts"? BRYAN HIGBYhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01126595775432851053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-63357576649403430622019-06-27T08:49:13.684-05:002019-06-27T08:49:13.684-05:00Fifteen or so years ago, in a collection of beginn...Fifteen or so years ago, in a collection of beginner stories, I used the <> pair in a manner similar to Ted Cross, to indicate telepathic conversations.<br /><br />The few readers (no need to torture anyone else!) didn't find that convention worthy of comment. I suspect readers will accommodate it just fine, once they figure it out (or read the note explaining it).<br /><br />Thanks, as always!tonylhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15317371592063754371noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-59544496267639117942019-06-27T07:03:37.052-05:002019-06-27T07:03:37.052-05:00Joe, can you please explain the difference between...Joe, can you please explain the difference between text with only an opening diple and text enclosed in an opening/closing diple pair? I mean the difference between this:<br /><br /><I hope it enhances the story, rather than distracts.<br /><br />and this:<br /><br /><Trust me; you can't possibly imagine what happens until you read it for yourself.>Paolo Amorosohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03789843965489611451noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-15656462589106795442019-06-26T17:53:11.477-05:002019-06-26T17:53:11.477-05:00Great minds... or Cunningham's Law.
Which boo...Great minds... or Cunningham's Law.<br /><br />Which books, Ted? I'd like to take a look.JA Konrathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-30432850306362982642019-06-26T17:34:08.126-05:002019-06-26T17:34:08.126-05:00I've been using the < > in my novels to ...I've been using the < > in my novels to offset all dialogue done using wi-fi in mind interfaces, where people aren't speaking aloud.Ted Crosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09022309459554237650noreply@blogger.com