tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post249287263022148842..comments2024-03-28T02:00:11.260-05:00Comments on A Newbie's Guide to Publishing: The Writer As SpendthriftJA Konrathhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comBlogger65125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-8743461011873136282009-02-22T14:26:00.000-06:002009-02-22T14:26:00.000-06:00Great post, Joe! A lot of truth in there.Best bit...Great post, Joe! A lot of truth in there.<BR/><BR/>Best bit of advice I can give to others: finish the damned book. Too many would-be writers spend years writing but never finishing anything. The worst part is, the first book anybody writes is likely to be crap, so the sooner you get it done, the sooner you can move on to the next story you want to tell, which will be a lot better.Brian O'Rourkehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02372815069471434698noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-34196912722142767032009-02-03T20:24:00.000-06:002009-02-03T20:24:00.000-06:00Great post, but I'm with Mark. Ambition--stretchin...Great post, but I'm with Mark. Ambition--stretching myself as a writer--is what makes me happy.Patry Francishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10961915797919017179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-17607618382338611982009-01-29T14:12:00.000-06:002009-01-29T14:12:00.000-06:00Unfortunately, the world is full of people who are...Unfortunately, the world is full of people who are ready willing and eager to "teach" something to others that they can't do themselves. <BR/><BR/>I myself am going to teach swimming this summer. I'm going to do it in the shallow end of the pool, though, because I sink when my feet don't touch.<BR/><BR/>Anyone want to sign up? The classes are only $150.00 a hour--very reasonable.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-58571385753970323142009-01-28T11:22:00.000-06:002009-01-28T11:22:00.000-06:00I'm gonna go out on a limb here...And say it...Tra...I'm gonna go out on a limb here...<BR/><BR/>And say it...<BR/><BR/>Traditionally published authors don't know squat.<BR/><BR/>I advocate that only clueless, money-hungry thieves and bandits should be allowed to give advice to aspiring writers.<BR/><BR/>In fact, the more brain damaged the speaker, the better!<BR/><BR/>Surely, I'm not alone.<BR/><BR/>Join me in the revolution, folks!<BR/><BR/>Let's take back the publishing business from those who actually know what they're doing!<BR/><BR/>Visit <A HREF="http://www.howtopublishabook.org" REL="nofollow">howtopublishabook.org</A> if you believe you've got a better story to tell than 99.9% of the traditionally published authors out there!Stacey Cochranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14128613653591282474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-20949060655915088542009-01-27T19:33:00.000-06:002009-01-27T19:33:00.000-06:00This comment has been removed by the author.Sarah Cypherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14675454668536913182noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-16402754504805633572009-01-27T17:57:00.000-06:002009-01-27T17:57:00.000-06:00AMEN to the point about the how-to books by writer...AMEN to the point about the how-to books by writers who have never published anything worth noting. I was just looking at not one but TWO highly touted and well-marketed books on novel-writing by an author who has written several, but all were self-published. If you can't write a novel that a publisher is willing to pay you money for, I don't want your advice. <BR/><BR/>Besides the King and Morrel books, I'd add Elizabeth George's "Write Away."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-87800119971226861122009-01-27T14:34:00.000-06:002009-01-27T14:34:00.000-06:00Great post, great discussion. On the topic of MFA'...Great post, great discussion. <BR/><BR/>On the topic of MFA's...I would say most (but not all, of course) writers who have MFAs write literary fiction as opposed to genre fiction. True or false?Melissa Amateishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16086267508858187716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-59869472976880957032009-01-27T13:44:00.000-06:002009-01-27T13:44:00.000-06:00On Sunday, I led a discussion in Wilmington, North...On Sunday, I led a discussion in Wilmington, North Carolina on the topic of how to publish a book.<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4nrnBat3cs" REL="nofollow">Watch Video of the Discussion</A><BR/><BR/>Now, I have not been widely published. In fact, I've received over 2000 rejection letters over the course of 15 years and have been completely unable to find a publisher or literary agent for my fiction.<BR/><BR/>Nonetheless, this has been my full-time occupation... for almost half my life now.<BR/><BR/>And I think doing discussions like these help (me and the attendees). To be fair, I often interview better established authors, editors, and agents because they do have more credibility. Still, I know attendees grow and learn from the kinds of discussions like I did in Wilmington.<BR/><BR/>Not only that, many of them go on to self publish (a few have found traditional publishers) and then in turn go into their communities and lead events themselves.<BR/><BR/>I think is a healthy and positive way to contribute to your community, and I disagree with the idea that only traditionally published authors should lead discussion on publishing and writing.<BR/><BR/>As long as you're giving something back to your community and the people around you...<BR/><BR/>I will be balanced and happy my entire life as long as I'm giving something back to my community.Stacey Cochranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14128613653591282474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-88499851138915076342009-01-27T10:39:00.000-06:002009-01-27T10:39:00.000-06:00I am so glad I found your blog. I'm a new writer ...I am so glad I found your blog. I'm a new writer who is like a deer caught in headlights right now. I'm in the second stage of editing my book but i'm so worried about what to do next that I almost cannot concentrate.<BR/><BR/>Thank you for all the wonderful information.Strongblkwmnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01943807196468824583noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-28162066606790239992009-01-27T06:18:00.000-06:002009-01-27T06:18:00.000-06:00Anon--Envy is a slippery slope. It's easy to look ...Anon--Envy is a slippery slope. It's easy to look at other writers and wish you had their breaks. But chances are those writers are also looking at other writers and wishing they had their breaks, and so on.<BR/><BR/>Isn't productivity a result of dissatisfaction, at least on some level?<BR/><BR/>jwhit--your way is certainly more correct. :)<BR/><BR/>If 'professional' modifies the preceding verb, it should be "act professionally" describing how one acts.<BR/><BR/>But used as an adjective, 'professional' can also modify the unwritten subject. "Act like a professional" or "be professional" would have sounded better.<BR/><BR/>Maybe if I had an MFA I wouldn't abuse grammar so much. But maybe not.JA Konrathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-41564720950416543212009-01-26T21:50:00.000-06:002009-01-26T21:50:00.000-06:00Loved it, Joe. But:Writing is a profession. Act pr...Loved it, Joe. <BR/><BR/>But:<BR/>Writing is a profession. Act professional.<BR/><BR/>Shouldn't that last be 'professionally'? ;-)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-43194471456129517522009-01-26T17:02:00.000-06:002009-01-26T17:02:00.000-06:00Cool post! But I'm surprised to hear you're not al...Cool post! But I'm surprised to hear you're not all that happy, Joe. From my seat, I would be THRILLED to have your career. But I guess being perpetually dissatisfied is part of your success "secret." Come to think of it, I know writers who envy the fact that I had a big-name agent once and I've had a few short stories published. Big whoop. I'm still an unpublished novelist.<BR/><BR/><I>I wouldn't give up on a child that was problematic, and I wouldn't give up on a problematic manuscript either.</I><BR/><BR/>I finished two novels--the second led to representation. I got 20k into my third novel and realized the premise was flawed, so I kicked it out of the house. It wasn't my "child"--it was a bunch of words on paper that were making me miserable. <BR/><BR/>But if you happen to be a writer who's never finished a novel (like a friend of mine), then I think this advice applies.<BR/><BR/>I'd also like to add that I've learned more about writing by reading and "dismantling" novels than I have from any class or any how-to books.<BR/><BR/>Oh, and there's a woman I know who teaches a lot of writing classes and workshops--and yet her bio mentions that she's written five unpublished novels. Doesn't exactly inspire confidence.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-83517117035871126222009-01-26T13:32:00.000-06:002009-01-26T13:32:00.000-06:00Great post. I've enjoyed the back and forth in the...Great post. I've enjoyed the back and forth in the comments here, too. You have quite the engaged readership!Jennifer Rolandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12856781609646639172noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-66667173248645913842009-01-26T09:59:00.000-06:002009-01-26T09:59:00.000-06:00Joe, thanks. I'm putting some of those on materia...Joe, thanks. I'm putting some of those on materials in my HS creative writing class, and crediting you. We'll see if that at least can help to popularize some of them, and that's a start, right?Jake Nantzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16637039507172446111noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-40401132502429429532009-01-26T09:36:00.000-06:002009-01-26T09:36:00.000-06:00Definitely one of the best blogs for the newbie wr...Definitely one of the best blogs for the newbie writer. I was recently at a writer's meeting where many, many people wanted to know about self-publishing. If you don't really want to go anywhere, fine. But it is a sign of the desperation people have to see their name in print, regardless of whether or not they have mastered craft. Every writing conference I go to I focus on craft, because I can never learn enough. And know what? It got me published with a major house. <BR/>Thanks so much for the insight here and I'm passing this on to all of the groups I know.Molly Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14353412599195708232noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-9127535069824505342009-01-26T09:01:00.000-06:002009-01-26T09:01:00.000-06:00I like your site and style and advice, and the ope...I like your site and style and advice, and the open exchanges. And the warnings. Well done.<BR/><BR/>Let me add a couple of points about writing books and teachers. When I was learning the craft, I devoured writing books and (this is important) applied what resonated to my writing. And gradually, found out what worked for me. In fact, I had a major epiphany from reading a single chapter in a book, which, after that, led to my becoming a selling author. My philosophy is, if you learn one thing that helps, it's worth it. You can both study writing and write at the same time.<BR/><BR/>That's why I don't always think it's better to write than study writing. As Bobby Knight used to say, "Practice doesn't make perfect; perfect practice makes perfect." And then he drummed his players with the fundamentals. So do both. Learn and write (and I'm not sure a writing group is always the best venue for that, but that's another story).<BR/><BR/>Re: teachers. I don't think being published is the sole criterion to consider. The main criterion ought to be whether his STUDENTS get published. Sort of like Lee Strasberg with actors. He wasn't a major working actor, but a teacher of actors, with great success.<BR/><BR/>I agree with you heartily that not all (in fact, most) successful writers are not great teachers. But there are some great teachers who are not monetarily successful writers (in the area of major contracts, etc.), either. <BR/><BR/>As with anything in life, caveat emptor. And your site contains some excellent caveats.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-55722400357682486142009-01-26T06:57:00.000-06:002009-01-26T06:57:00.000-06:00Ben--It's because experience is all subjective, an...Ben--It's because experience is all subjective, and people draw conclusions after events have already happened.<BR/><BR/>For example, most successful businessmen will rattle off the same reasons for their success: hard work, refusal to quit, taking chances, etc.<BR/><BR/>But there are many people who aren't millionaires who do the same things.<BR/><BR/>Attributing significance to an occurrence after it happens is why so many people believe in the power of prayer. Child is sick. Parent prays. Child gets better. Prayer works. <BR/><BR/>It doesn't matter that they've prayed before and not gotten those prayers answered, because the Lord works in mysterious ways, and Skinner showed that periodic behavioral rewards are more powerful than constant behavioral rewards, which is why we have so many folks with gambling problems.<BR/><BR/>A successful businessman who thinks he worked hard will attribute his success to working hard. A writer who publishes a book will attribute that success to "writing a good book".<BR/><BR/>Because there are no control subjects in these experiments (though, strangely enough, I know of two studies that have shown sick people who are being prayed for have a slightly higher chance if dying), there is no way to prove "x happened because of y."<BR/><BR/>For it to be shown that "y will happen if you do x" then it must be able to be predicted, and repeated.<BR/><BR/>But it can't be. Because the overriding factor is luck.<BR/><BR/>Hard work, taking chances, never giving up, writing good books, all are important in that they can improve your odds.<BR/><BR/>But people don't like to think their good fortunes are based on luck, especially when they no doubt did work hard for them.JA Konrathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-67344268451748555332009-01-26T01:05:00.000-06:002009-01-26T01:05:00.000-06:00Wow Joe, that post was chock full of useful nugget...Wow Joe, that post was chock full of useful nuggets of wisdom. <BR/><BR/>I've read "how to write" books with much less info then your one blog post.<BR/><BR/>Thanks for saving me $50.<BR/><BR/>Question for thought, why with every endeavor someone takes on, whether it be writing, playing chess, baseball, etc... does everyone always think that there is just one "secret", that will instantly make them good? They blatantly ignore hard work, and just keep looking for the magic potion. <BR/><BR/>I'm 100% guilty of this.<BR/><BR/>I'm also 100% guilty of procrastination. Now off to go read more about writing, and actually never putting anymore words to page, then I do in blog comments.<BR/><BR/>Sad, but true. I know my faults, I now have to change them.PokerBenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01861605814143830904noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-22036361146197361892009-01-25T15:39:00.000-06:002009-01-25T15:39:00.000-06:00Here's mine for Bartlett's, inspired by a recent N...Here's mine for Bartlett's, inspired by a recent Nathan Bransford post:<BR/><BR/><I>If you think you're above average, then you haven't set the bar high enough.</I><BR/><BR/>:)Jude Hardinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09994813046526310594noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-48296129644312758582009-01-25T14:31:00.000-06:002009-01-25T14:31:00.000-06:00Mark-- Are you asking if I'm happy with my career?...Mark-- Are you asking if I'm happy with my career?<BR/><BR/>In a nutshell, no I'm not. <BR/><BR/>I have moments of happiness. I have times where I'm content. But measured against the times that I struggle, the struggle outweighs the happiness.<BR/><BR/>That's why I blog about the struggle, and why this blog isn't called "A Newbie's Guide to Self-Fulfillment."<BR/><BR/>It's also why I'm productive and tenacious.<BR/><BR/>Helen--That's kind of you, Helen. If you'd like, you can send me the $50. :)<BR/><BR/>Ann--I love metaphors and analogies. They're my kryptonite.<BR/><BR/>Dave--If someone wants to get an MFA in order to teach, or out of the fun of learning, or to study the esoteric art of poetry, they should go for it.<BR/><BR/>If someone wants to get an MFA to get published, they should save their time and money. But you knew I'd say that, and it won't convince you any more than you're convincing me. But it's fun to discuss.<BR/><BR/>behler--I agree authors need to be educated about the business. But people who aspire to write just don't think that way.<BR/><BR/>For some reason, highly intelligent folks, leaders in their professions, still get sucked in to vanity publishing and paying for agents. They'd never dream of investing in the stock market without researching it thoroughly, but when it comes to one's own written words the craving for acceptance and approval is so strong that many are ignorant of the perils.<BR/><BR/>No other art form boasts so many clueless people.<BR/><BR/>Perhaps it's because everyone believes they can write.<BR/><BR/>Perhaps because rejection is so scary, people prefer ignorance. <BR/><BR/>Perhaps because the publishing industry really doesn't make much sense to begin with.<BR/><BR/>Maybe the problem is subjectivity itself.<BR/><BR/>Let's say I'm the lead in a rock band. We need a guitarist. Someone auditions, but isn't quite good enough, so I tell him to take lessons. The guy takes lessons, gets better, and then I'd let him join the band.<BR/><BR/>He didn't play the songs well before, went to an expert for instruction, and now he can play the songs.<BR/><BR/>But that's objective. He either hits the notes or he doesn't. The instructor taught him how to do exactly what was expected of him.<BR/><BR/>With writing, no one is sure what is expected of anyone. So there's no way to prove the person is hitting the right notes.JA Konrathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08778324558755151986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-52587816929701195882009-01-25T13:22:00.000-06:002009-01-25T13:22:00.000-06:00Joe, Are you unhappy?Joe, <BR/>Are you unhappy?Mark Terryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09410424046477699059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-40952540243918572252009-01-25T12:24:00.000-06:002009-01-25T12:24:00.000-06:00Surely you can see the ethical dilemma. There have...<B>Surely you can see the ethical dilemma. There have been countless scams with agents, editors, and freelance book doctors referring newbie writers to each other for kickbacks and fees.</B><BR/><BR/>Yes, of course the potential for abuse reigns supreme in many areas, but that doesn't mean everyone should be painted with the same brush because they make a recommendation. Authors in this day and age have to be more educated to the industry than their predecessors, and this is no exception. <BR/><BR/>Anyone who has been given a recommendation should research that indie editor thoroughly. That said, I know several of my editor buds with much larger houses who make the same recommendations. <BR/><BR/>But as I said earlier, I agree with you that authors need to learn to do their own editing because they're the ones who are tasked with their rewrites during the editing phase.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-59481294329857205402009-01-25T11:31:00.000-06:002009-01-25T11:31:00.000-06:00>I'd also love to find the statistic of how...>I'd also love to find the statistic of how many MFAs are given out by colleges every year, and how many of those people wind up selling a book to a big NY publishing house.<BR/>I'd bet the statistics would support my opinion here too. Especially when compared to the number of people who graduate top medical schools and then go on to practice medicine.<BR/><BR/>Joe, not all MFA students are interested in writing novels. Some are interested in the esoteric art of writing poetry, others in teaching, others in simply learning. What would be far more interesting would be to know what's the average advance for a first book from an MFA writer compared to writers without MFAs, and same with amount of time getting an agent and a book deal.<BR/><BR/>Small Crimes got a fair amount of critical acclaim, rave reviews in the Washington Post, Boston Globe, topping NPR's list for best crime fiction of 2008, etc., but my path for getting the book published was a long and painful one, and I have little doubt it would've been much easier (and more lucrative, at least initially) if I had an MFA due to the support system and networking aspects to the degree. Since taking Solstice workshop years ago at Pine Manor college, I go every once in a while to the MFA events there. It's such a different world that I find it interesting, and I talk to the faculty and students, as well as agents and editors who sometimes show up. I know for a fact that the path can be easier with the MFA. And again, I'm guessing more lucrative, at least initially.<BR/><BR/>Btw. I have to admit I do make fun of MFA programs in my book, Pariah.Dave Zeltsermanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04007736514118297783noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-27502891409151700422009-01-25T11:15:00.000-06:002009-01-25T11:15:00.000-06:00"I love going to magic shows. But I also love lear..."I love going to magic shows. But I also love learning how the trick is done."<BR/><BR/>I agree. But the best magicians don't only find value in learning how a trick is done. They also must understand the magic from the enthralled audience member's point of view. They feel the magic. They develop an intuitive understanding of it that comes from enjoyment, not -only- study.<BR/><BR/>Do you think we've beaten this metaphor to death?Ann Voss Petersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15141783064748972033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11291165.post-19559218603135353722009-01-25T11:13:00.000-06:002009-01-25T11:13:00.000-06:00No arguments from me. I love your straight-forward...No arguments from me. I love your straight-forward, tell it like you see it, approach. Although...you didn't really save me $50. You just postponed it, since if you came to my area, I'd take your class.Helen Gingerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09794759602654727110noreply@blogger.com